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Big_Monkey_Brother

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Registration date : 2008-12-09

PostSubject: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:09 am

Easy game, right? Each item has a proper counter-measure. But it's a game of chance, partially, and a game where understanding the history of your opponents performance will aid you in victory.

True of TF2 as well.

Sentry kills scout
Pryo kills spy
Sniper kills most
Spy kills all

Demoman - great @ medium range, ass handed to them at kissing range
Heavy - lousy at long range, moving target
Engie - low health results in a swift death

And on and on....

Why is it some teams can't seem to get out of their own base in 2Fort? Did they plan to camp their base the whole time? Or is the other team pushing so hard they can't get out? Is it easier to rake in the kills when your targets come to you, rather than you hunting them out?

So last night was Nova's team camping? I only played for an hour and a half but it didn't seem so to me - yet blue was up by two for a long while...

My 2 cents - the accusation of camping is used a bit too liberally. Agreed it is sometimes warranted, but not always.

So I'll offer this at the end of the rant - in LFD VS if the survivors hide in the barn, or under a stairwell, or on a rock, a valid infected strategy is to park the tank... effectively drawing them out. Same is true in 2Fort - not everyone on the public interwebz will play the game exactly the way you would like it to be played but the next time you feel the other team is camping, I propose you camp yourself. Invite them out. Call their bluff.... worth a try?
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Toilet Duk

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:11 am

It was less camping than we were constantly encountering you guys in our front door, on our battlements, and in our sewer, and it was just impossible to get out with any effectiveness.
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krazykid

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:36 am

I call it camping when more than the engies and two or MAYBE three other players on the team are hanging out in their base jerking each other off behind a dispenser.

Then you have to account for the spawn time. If the campers are holding off the other team, and not getting killed and not tring to get out of the base... then the other team will likely come at the camp site in waves.


When I feel like our team is camping, I will turn on the krazy kid tactics and try to turn the tables. If there is a sentry in front of out base, or in our sewer, that is one less (hopefully) that I have to shoot down with my pistol! If there isnt, I will just cloak past everyone, and go un detected into the intel room. Pick up the shit and.... wait I cant give out all my ideas.
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Ocean_NB
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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 9:15 am

Krazy's tactic is one I have been preaching for a long time. Pinned in your base, go spy and touch the intel. You have a small window of importunity to start pushing and make you way out while the other team does the typical knee jerk response of flocking to the intel to protect it.

The last two night have been good back and forth games, and as for Nova's team camping, ironically that only lasted for the 5-10 min immediately following Nova's voiceall accusation of our team camping. The stalemate was mostly due to mid bridge/water collisions. The hunting parties would get thinned out and as a result, not be able to deeply penetrate the other team's base defenses.

The 3 nights prior we not such back and forth events that the last two were. As for holding back the offense to lure them out, that is exactly what I did. I switched from demo to Sniper or Eng just to see if my missing offense would help them get out of their base. At one time, both Nova and I were ENGs. ENGs for a base no one was attacking, but ENGs none the less.

It's not so easy to lure a camping team out of their base... Newton's first laws of motion seems to take over. You seem to get stuck in your rut, you think "fuck, I'm getting so many kills, and look I have the top guys dominated, why change what I'm doing when this is working for me"


So to sum up... Monkey is a camper.

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FHCtyler21

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 9:41 am

Somewhere in eastern PA, a drunken cyclops is laughing Cool
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Faith-away

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 11:09 am

Nova's team was absolutely not camping for the majority of the game until Scynthus unfortunately got auto-balanced over to the blue team, and that's when things went south. Once that happened, our team had basically free reign over midfield, while nguyen, while being quite a good sniper, wasn't able to hold off 2 snipers (sometimes 3 until MAN switched/quit) and the rest of the team dominating the front. Plus, it seemed like good players kept leaving for the night from the red team like Gung-Ho (oh will my suspicions ever go away about him?) and Blood. Things were actually quite even for a bit...but then the wrong guys left the red team.

You could tell Nova was getting close to rage-quit levels when he started bitching about "spawn" camping when our team was trying to get the last cap and people were trying to hold the hay room. I chuckled.
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Nova

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 11:24 am

naa i never close to rage quitting.. i knew we'd lose that game eventually so it didnt come as a surprise that we did lose.. it took every one of your players inside our base.. and a medic'd heavy to spawn camp us to make it happen so i was in no way close to rage quitting...

as for the game last night one team was better balanced than the other.. we tried and tried to get out and bring the fight to the bridge but when you start running out and dink lose 40% of your health the fight you're bringing is a little weaker...

you guys were so in our faces that we were just fighting and fighting and fighting... i'd finally make it to your side after like 5 tries and then make it down to your basement figuring everyone was on our side and still somehow you managed to throw 3 guys at me every time so i could never get the intel out..

your team was simply better last night.

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Nova looks like a dick who TEARS ONLINE COMMUNITIES APART!

Anonymous: here you go Nova... brace your self, sit down and enjoy... last time you will here this...............................................
Anonymous: you were right


"man with hand in pants feels cocky all day!"
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pepple84

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 2:17 pm

on red kristy got killed last night. A LOT.

one of the things i noticed on blu team was the majority of players kept switching classes. this helped to balance out an offense defense strategy. nobody was stuck in a set role, ie: engie guarding an sg the entire time. blu was quite balanced as a team last night.
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Faith-away

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 3:12 pm

The sad thing Nova is, that some substantial periods during last night's game, blue had NO defense to speak of besides the snipers. I don't know how many times I saw that someone grabbed the intel without even seeing a sentry gun get blown up or anything. I started to get annoyed because while we seemed to be dominating the front of the base, I got burned twice by pyros on the balcony...and as far as I'm concerned, that should NEVER happen to a sniper.
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Nova

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 3:30 pm

pretty stupid of one of our pyros to waste time going after a sniper instead of going down to get the intel.. but that's what you get when people play in a haphazard sort of individual way.. its like they've finally made it to the other side and now they are going to pay back the guys that have been suppressing them all along...

i agree with you that your defense was weak and wanted to respond as such to pepple but i couldnt find any words that didnt seem snarky or arrogant.. yeah your team WAS able to play various classes and swap between engie and all classes.. we couldnt really get out of our base.. bottom line... we tried various routes but your team was caught in the meat grinder so there was always someone trailing behind to pick us off.. mostly kill kristy or tyler my medics which forced me to go it alone.. i did grab your intel several times but without the support of a follow up thrust it was wasted.. the intel simply went back a minute later as it would again take us several efforts to get anywhere near your base..

its one thing to CHOOSE to go thru the sewers while others on your team are engaging on the bridge.. its quite different going thru the sewers when you're the only ones taking the trip to your side.. no slight on anyone on our team we were all doing our best.. problem was bridge access was unavailable so we couldnt slow you down at all until you all made it into the base.

personally i enjoyed the game.. i dont like losing but it happens and it wasnt from any lack of effort.. in fact some guys probably had a pretty unenjoyable night (our engies and medics) but hung in there to the bitter end without giving up..

i look forward to more of it... and hopefully next time i will be on the other end =)

and monkey is definitely a camper.

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Faith-away wrote:
Nova looks like a dick who TEARS ONLINE COMMUNITIES APART!

Anonymous: here you go Nova... brace your self, sit down and enjoy... last time you will here this...............................................
Anonymous: you were right


"man with hand in pants feels cocky all day!"
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smuggler

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 3:51 pm

I played engineer almost the entire map (until Kristy got tired of playing medic and switched with me). It was pretty rough but it also had it's highlights. Gurt, Monkey and Faith all rocket jumped on battlements. With my lowly shotgun I got all 3 in about 5 seconds. Other than that it was build sentry, hear Kristy call out an uber incoming, watch sentry and dispenser get destroyed, rebuild.

I feel most nights comes down to the random people on the teams. Most of the eXiled members are on my friends list and you are all great TF2 players. When I press tab and see 8 of them on the opposite team and only 4 on my team, I know it will be a long night. The random people that join don't seem to care about team balance. They come in wanting to play their class and that's it. -[Killaz]-l33t-SnIpEr isn't going to play defense or help get intel even if we already have 2 snipers.

Maybe I need to be like Faith and start berating people to either help out or get off the server.
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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 3:58 pm

smuggler wrote:
Maybe I need to be like Faith and start berating people to either help out or get off the server.

If you want Faith to start berating people, just make it so he can't turn off all talk. The longer he has to listen to people over the mic on both teams, the sooner he will go crazy and start scaring people away Razz
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Cowboy

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:05 pm

Do don't know about you guys, but I could honestly care less about the stats and kills and shit, I just wanna get that intel and keep the other boys out. The numbers don't avail anything but bragging rights, so they are essentially useless, don;t think most of us camp to pad the numbers. Started out playing spy last night just for shits when things were stable, but when we started getting mercilessly pummeled from all 4 entry points to our base, any offence we did have evaporated back into the shell. Without 2 good snipers holding the bridge and battlements, it is a whole different game. We had lots of different classes even, a good mix I thought. but I would literally go from fighting a bunch in the courtyard with a heavy to heading to grab ammo and health at the spawn and being hit with rockets and grenades from the grate and battlements entrance the whole way and watching them pour in behind us. Poor Smug tried to hold the line as best he could, but in the end the organized rushes and lack of counter sniping and control of the mid-map ruined us:) But it was even early on so all good...


Last edited by Cowboy on Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Cowboy

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:15 pm

for a lot of the night, there was literally NO on e on our battlements cept the other team:)
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Faith-away

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Tue Feb 10, 2009 5:30 pm

If you all could be more like me, the world would be a much more peaceful place because everyone would be wonderful...and have puppies.
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Frank_is_game

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PostSubject: Re: rock, paper, scissors   Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:45 am

This is a good thread for the normally overlooked sniper Smile
Another thing i thought i would point out is that the offensive team has to break the camp up to score. A good strategy for that is to put a sentry on the bridge and spam the battlements with some demos, they will come pouring out of the base before long and make for a easier push.
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